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musashi75
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PostSubject: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:33 am

I've been using an Odyssey putter with an insert since I started playing golf. One thing I've noticed is that it feels good for close range putts but I struggle with lag putts. I'd like to ask if a spin milled putter is any better at distance control.

Considering a price of a spin milled putter is often many times the price of an Odyssey putter with an insert, I was wondering what the difference was. So far inserts seem to do just fine for me for short and medium range putts. For long range putts, I'm wondering whether it's a myth that spin milled putters give better feel or whether it's just a lack of practice/skill on my putt to measure the distance with putters with an insert.

Thanks
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eiji
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:42 am

Borrow a mates spin milled. Get on the practice green and make your own comparison.

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watermyforrest
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:51 am

Or better still come over to BFG at Bukit Merah... lots of testing putters to try with nice indoor putting greens....
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Duval_S
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 10:45 am

I too have the same problem....with insert, I somehow cant lag my putt as I could with the one without....

Maybe next round, I should bring 2 putters...one with insert for short putt (Rosie II)..and one without insert (Anser-X)
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DRGjr72
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:24 pm

Inserts are designed to change the sound of the putter and sound has been associated with how a putter feels, since the ball is already well gone from the putter head by the time your hands actually feel the strike. Sound travels faster and that is the sensation your brain recognizes first. From my understanding is that the sound a ball or putter makes is then translated to how it feels.

I would argue that holds true for Drivers and Irons to some degree. I can recall I had a tour issue HiBore that had the harshest feel to it and I have to think it was the sound of the driver as it was freakishly loud, compared to say my R7 425TP that was much "softer" feeling. Although both were made from relatively the same materials, both had quite different sounds.

Harder feel is associated with a harder, louder, or harsher sound. Where as a softer feel is associated with a muted, more subtle sound.

The main issues with putting and consistency is a good fitting putter, good aim, decent direction, speed control, and consistent striking of the putt. If you can do these things, you can be a good/great putter.

There are elements of technology that are incorporated into todays putters, moreso than some of years past. There is reduction in twisting from off center hits, groove technology, inserts, shaft technology, different grips, etc. The bottom line for me is to find a putter that you like to look down at, one that puts a great roll on the ball for you (meaning it fits), and finally the most important part...one that have confidence in. Without confidence it does not matter if you have the most expensive putter in the world, you will doubt it and you will not make a good stroke, thus reducing your chances of making a putt. A solid putting routine also helps as it can take away some of the tension or doubt.

I think in the case of your lag putting with respect to the insert, if your mid to short range putting is good, it might be a case of lack of practice. It is actually pretty easy to accomplish in a short period of time. I would suggest taking 12 balls and putt to a flag that is 30 feet away. Make sure to hit the putt and wait 3 seconds after the putt has left the putter head before you look, while the ball is on the way guess out loud as to whether it is short or long based on the "feel" of the strike. This reinforces the learning that you are doing. Do this back and forth from the two pins for 20 mins. Now do the same thing without guessing and try to get the balls all within a certain distance from the hole (say 3 feet). Continue to do these types of drills and you will most certainly improve your lag putting.

Hope that helps a little...(sorry for the length, to much inside my head to share...HA)
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golf_snowman
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:41 pm

err....i was trying to understand the lingo here...

Does 'Lag Putt' = 'Long distance putt' ? scratch scratch

do tolerate my ignorance as I still trying to learn as much from reading these interesting post..haha !!!

If i putt from the fringe or even outside the fringe, does that consider a Lag Putt ?
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Winston
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 3:47 pm

DRGjr72 wrote:
Hope that helps a little...(sorry for the length, to much inside my head to share...HA)

Would love to pick your brain....free on friday afternoon to meet at BFG bukit merah??? or you could come up to Ho CHi Min city.... Laughing
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Gray
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 3:59 pm

Ypa man. Curious what lag putt means too
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JonL_TK
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:08 pm

Lag Putt

A long putt which, because of its length, the putter does not expect to make but hopes to get close to the cup, usually leaving it a bit short. A good lag putt positions the golfer to have a simple and easily makeable follow-up putt.
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musashi75
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:10 pm

Thanks for all the helpful advice so far. Unfortunately, I don't know anyone who is willing to part with their milled putter for a week or two so I am keen to get some feedback from people that have both spin milled putters and those with inserts to see if they feel that there's any difference.

Lag putting = putting from afar to within 3 feet.
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Duval_S
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:21 pm

give you one lobang......Panwest selling Cleveland putter for only $99......and its pretty good
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DRGjr72
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:23 pm

musashi75 wrote:
Thanks for all the helpful advice so far. Unfortunately, I don't know anyone who is willing to part with their milled putter for a week or two so I am keen to get some feedback from people that have both spin milled putters and those with inserts to see if they feel that there's any difference.

Lag putting = putting from afar to within 3 feet.

Might check with Eric at the Den. He might have something you could test out there to see what the feel is like. I know he has two putting greens there and several types of putters. Go over there for a few hours and roll some putts. I am sure you will be able to "feel" the difference between the two.

Also the type of golf ball you use can affect "feel" as well. A top flite or super hard ball will feel totally different to a ball like the Pro V1.

Dan
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DRGjr72
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:28 pm

Winston wrote:
DRGjr72 wrote:
Hope that helps a little...(sorry for the length, to much inside my head to share...HA)

Would love to pick your brain....free on friday afternoon to meet at BFG bukit merah??? or you could come up to Ho CHi Min city.... Laughing

Hi Winston,

I was thinking of going over to the Den on Friday as it was, funny coincidence. I would also love to go to Ho Chi Min City, but the first time I go I think I best go with the wife to keep the peace at home..HA!!!

I am thinking that I will stop by sometime in the afternoon when my little guy goes down for his nap. Should be sometime after 1:00. If you can make it would be my pleasure to have a chat. Can never meet enough nice people over here....

Dan
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musashi75
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:39 pm


Might check with Eric at the Den. He might have something you could test out there to see what the feel is like. I know he has two putting greens there and several types of putters. Go over there for a few hours and roll some putts. I am sure you will be able to "feel" the difference between the two.

Also the type of golf ball you use can affect "feel" as well. A top flite or super hard ball will feel totally different to a ball like the Pro V1.

Dan[/quote]

Hi Dan,

Thanks very much for your feedback. I'll try to make an appointment with Eric as suggested. I've been very keen to try out the Zen putters that people have discussed here, too!

Cheers
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Derek
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 10:18 pm

musashi75 wrote:
Thanks for all the helpful advice so far. Unfortunately, I don't know anyone who is willing to part with their milled putter for a week or two so I am keen to get some feedback from people that have both spin milled putters and those with inserts to see if they feel that there's any difference.

Lag putting = putting from afar to within 3 feet.

Hi Musashi, I've got a Nike blade putter (no insert) which I do not use. If u want to try it out, drop by Marina Bay Golf Course. I used to use a Odyssey White Hot, now I use the Black Series iX (with insert).

My personal experience is that having an insert (or not) did not have an impact on my distance control with long putts. As Dan mentioned, practising long putts helped. Of course, being familiar with the green speed helps even more ...

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musashi75
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:05 pm

Derek wrote:
musashi75 wrote:
Thanks for all the helpful advice so far. Unfortunately, I don't know anyone who is willing to part with their milled putter for a week or two so I am keen to get some feedback from people that have both spin milled putters and those with inserts to see if they feel that there's any difference.

Lag putting = putting from afar to within 3 feet.

Hi Musashi, I've got a Nike blade putter (no insert) which I do not use. If u want to try it out, drop by Marina Bay Golf Course. I used to use a Odyssey White Hot, now I use the Black Series iX (with insert).

My personal experience is that having an insert (or not) did not have an impact on my distance control with long putts. As Dan mentioned, practising long putts helped. Of course, being familiar with the green speed helps even more ...
Hi Derek,

Really appreciate the kind offer. I'm currently using the Odyssey white hot ice #1. it's a blade putter too. I definitely will spend more time practicing long putts.
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golfool2009
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:09 pm

DRGjr72 wrote:
Inserts are designed to change the sound of the putter and sound has been associated with how a putter feels, since the ball is already well gone from the putter head by the time your hands actually feel the strike. Sound travels faster and that is the sensation your brain recognizes first. From my understanding is that the sound a ball or putter makes is then translated to how it feels.

I would argue that holds true for Drivers and Irons to some degree. I can recall I had a tour issue HiBore that had the harshest feel to it and I have to think it was the sound of the driver as it was freakishly loud, compared to say my R7 425TP that was much "softer" feeling. Although both were made from relatively the same materials, both had quite different sounds.

Harder feel is associated with a harder, louder, or harsher sound. Where as a softer feel is associated with a muted, more subtle sound.


If I understand you correctly, you make a very interesting point that the feel should be the same regardless of insert v milled but the sound gives the illusion of softer v harder feel...i have 3 putters at home; cleveland brz putter with insert, odyssey marxman with insert and a SC california milled putter.....and i rank them in that specific order from soft to hard feel...

the cleveland putter was very much softer than the other 2 while there was only a slight diff between the odyssey and SC......

however, i completely agree that there are many more factors than just the face of the putter.....i like the mallet for shorter putts and the blade for longer putts....i've compromised and have now thrown in a mid mallet into the bag....let's see how this experiment turns out.....

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eiji
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:13 pm

Golfgool, my analysis of what you just said.

You would not like the mid mallet for short or long putts, ergo you will need to visit the Den for a putter fitting. Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:25 pm

golfool2009 wrote:
DRGjr72 wrote:
Inserts are designed to change the sound of the putter and sound has been associated with how a putter feels, since the ball is already well gone from the putter head by the time your hands actually feel the strike. Sound travels faster and that is the sensation your brain recognizes first. From my understanding is that the sound a ball or putter makes is then translated to how it feels.

I would argue that holds true for Drivers and Irons to some degree. I can recall I had a tour issue HiBore that had the harshest feel to it and I have to think it was the sound of the driver as it was freakishly loud, compared to say my R7 425TP that was much "softer" feeling. Although both were made from relatively the same materials, both had quite different sounds.

Harder feel is associated with a harder, louder, or harsher sound. Where as a softer feel is associated with a muted, more subtle sound.


If I understand you correctly, you make a very interesting point that the feel should be the same regardless of insert v milled but the sound gives the illusion of softer v harder feel...i have 3 putters at home; cleveland brz putter with insert, odyssey marxman with insert and a SC california milled putter.....and i rank them in that specific order from soft to hard feel...

the cleveland putter was very much softer than the other 2 while there was only a slight diff between the odyssey and SC......

however, i completely agree that there are many more factors than just the face of the putter.....i like the mallet for shorter putts and the blade for longer putts....i've compromised and have now thrown in a mid mallet into the bag....let's see how this experiment turns out.....


bro ... which putter were u using during the GR game?

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Irons 5-Pw:  Titleist 704 CB NSP950 (Flex Unknown - think it is R)
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:31 pm

Derek wrote:

bro ... which putter were u using during the GR game?

ha...i was using odyssey...i just bought the SC today....

ok since you caught me in a bit of a white lie...my tests with the SC were performed on my putting mat......haha
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Wed Jun 22, 2011 11:37 pm

golfool2009 wrote:
Derek wrote:

bro ... which putter were u using during the GR game?

ha...i was using odyssey...i just bought the SC today....

ok since you caught me in a bit of a white lie...my tests with the SC were performed on my putting mat......haha

LOL! No lah ... just curious ... cos one putter good for long, one putter good for short ... what happens if new putter really in the middle, i.e. half f**k for everything??????

_________________
========================================
What's in the Bag

Driver: Callway X-Hot 10.5 with Fubuki 50S (pulled from a TM Burner SuperFast)
Woods: 19 Deg Callaway X-hot Proj X Stock S Flex
Hybrid: 22 Deg TM SF i70R, Cobra Baffler 25 Deg NS950R
Irons 5-Pw:  Titleist 704 CB NSP950 (Flex Unknown - think it is R)
Wedges: Perry Gear 52 Deg DG S300 and BFG 55 Deg KBS Hi-Rev, Tourstage 60 Deg
Putter: RIFE Antigua Island with Champ Large Grip
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:10 am

Derek wrote:
golfool2009 wrote:
Derek wrote:

bro ... which putter were u using during the GR game?

ha...i was using odyssey...i just bought the SC today....

ok since you caught me in a bit of a white lie...my tests with the SC were performed on my putting mat......haha

LOL! No lah ... just curious ... cos one putter good for long, one putter good for short ... what happens if new putter really in the middle, i.e. half f**k for everything??????

Practice to make sure you either land long from the pin land near the pin so you won't face the 1/2 F%&K distance lol! Beer
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Winston
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PostSubject: Re: Putters: spin milled vs inserts   Thu Jun 23, 2011 1:13 am

DRGjr72 wrote:
Winston wrote:
DRGjr72 wrote:
Hope that helps a little...(sorry for the length, to much inside my head to share...HA)

Would love to pick your brain....free on friday afternoon to meet at BFG bukit merah??? or you could come up to Ho CHi Min city.... Laughing

Hi Winston,

I was thinking of going over to the Den on Friday as it was, funny coincidence. I would also love to go to Ho Chi Min City, but the first time I go I think I best go with the wife to keep the peace at home..HA!!!

I am thinking that I will stop by sometime in the afternoon when my little guy goes down for his nap. Should be sometime after 1:00. If you can make it would be my pleasure to have a chat. Can never meet enough nice people over here....

Dan

sure sure, hope to see you there.....

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