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 Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?

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Lee36328
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:15 pm

jimmychoo wrote:
It's so interesting to see all the physic theory surfaced, thanks for the physic lesson cheers
So now, will flex affect the smash factor? Did I luckily guess the correct answer? Razz

Short answer, it might, a little bit.

Ideally, we should be forward leaning while hitting up at impact. Spin loft decreases, increasing smash factor. A flex that suits our swing speed will facilitate this.

If we are doing the opposite, spin loft increases and smash factor reduces. A flex that is too soft for our swing speed might cause this.

If I hit with a shaft that's too soft, I have to release early, from way behind, which slows down my hands, meaning I am unable to be forward leaning hitting up.

However, plugging some realistic numbers through the formula, I could not get anywhere near such a low smash factor that is being discussed. I also checked with my clubfitter, who pointed out he is losing around 20mph ball speed.

It would seem to suggest, possibly:
1. the impact is not on the sweet spot
2. the machine calibration might be off
3. the range ball is really out of whack
or some other reasons I have not anticipated.

The difference is too large to explain with what's been covered so far.
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Lee36328
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 8:27 pm

More smash factor fun facts...

Club head speed of 100mph at the sweet spot can vary from 93mph at the heel to 107mph at the toe, a variance of 14% from heel to toe.

In an old issue of Golf Digest, both JB Homes and Bubba Watson were clocked at 126mph clubhead speed with their drivers. But Bubba Watson's ball speed was 12mph higher. Check out their swings and see if you can spot why.
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TourSwing
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 9:46 pm

LousyGolfer wrote:
If a golfer uses a R flex driver has a swing speed of 110mph, ball speed of only 140 (Smash Factor: 1.27) but ball flies straight with a nice trajectory with 210m+ carry (and feels like a good hit on the sweet spot), will changing the shaft to a "S" or "X" improve the smash factor?

I was recently presented with this question and I can't really answer it as even though a "R" flex shaft may seem a bit soft for a 110mph swing speed, the fact that the ball is going straight should mean the club head returned squared to the ball. Furthermore, 140mph ball speed for 210m carry would indicate near ideal launch angles (so not really a problem with the kick point). Thus, I would guess that a "S" or "X" flex would not make much difference.

Anyone (esp club fitters) has any comments if the flex has to play a part in this low smash/impact factor?

In the meantime, I just tell him "you are using range balls lah... not meant to fly far one".


When diagnosing a problem, the process of elimination method works best for me ... and I always begin with the most obvious and simplest solution!

In this particular case I would use masking tape on the club head and identify the precise impact spot on the face. And then move on from there ...

Furthermore, for a 110mph swingspeed, a R flex shaft is definitely not stiff enough, and the choice between Stiff and X-Stiff needs to be made. Having said that, an R flex shaft "could" work for this player (seems unlikely). However, in this case it obviously isn't, so why persist with a ill fitted club!?

A ill-fitted shaft will have a (negative) impact on the result of the shot ... and a poor smash factor will be one of the symptoms!

Recommend the change ... and point in the direction of a reliable club fitter.
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LousyGolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:52 pm


@Lee36328:
Thanks for pointing out the error in my equation. Yes, e(kinetic) is a better formula.

@TourSwing
Whao...you carry the ball 300 yards!!!! The 110mph club head speed in question will be like a tortise to you man.

Back to the point of impact,,, instead of using masking tape as that will affect the impact factor as well, I used my marker-pen on ball approach (for those who do not know what this is, it is better not to as range operators will hate you for this. That is why I am not indicating the range that this was done). The readings were taken only from good shots that were on center or slightly above center hits (he can't hit 110mph and straight all the time, else he would have turned pro). I did sneek in 2 pro-v1s (balls from the pond) but he mishit those quite badly so cannot do a comparison (maybe mental stress).

Why this is an interesting case for me is I can't explain the poor impact factor as the difference is so great for a "good" hit? My scope is calibrated (as of Jun this year) so I am ruling out the scope. That's left me with a few possibilities:
1) His driver head is a lemon (which is unlikely)
2) The range ball sucks (they do look pretty worn)
3) The shaft flex too much on impact
4) combination of the above

Anyway, I have sent him on his way to a club fitter (I am just a lousy golfer so really am in no position to advice him on anything) but the interesting question still lingers in my head... if the club head returns square to the ball, impacts on center or slightly above center with the correct launch angle, will the flex of the shaft affect the smash factor?

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LousyGolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:58 pm

Quote :

I have played with an ang mo who used a stock Nike SQ 5900 R flex ( I should know because I bought it for him), who hit the trees, carry mind you, with his swing at Green Fairway Range. Those who played at GFairway, whats the range dropping at the trees and with range balls at that.

Whao... not too sure about GFairway but maybe bring him to RCC or MBGC range. If he can carry into the trees at the back of RCC or the net at the back of MBGC, then his carry would be ~300m... in which case, he can join the qualifiers for the ReMAX long drive championship.
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Lee36328
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Tue Dec 13, 2011 11:17 pm

LousyGolfer wrote:

@Lee36328:
Thanks for pointing out the error in my equation. Yes, e(kinetic) is a better formula.

@TourSwing
Whao...you carry the ball 300 yards!!!! The 110mph club head speed in question will be like a tortise to you man.

Back to the point of impact,,, instead of using masking tape as that will affect the impact factor as well, I used my marker-pen on ball approach (for those who do not know what this is, it is better not to as range operators will hate you for this. That is why I am not indicating the range that this was done). The readings were taken only from good shots that were on center or slightly above center hits (he can't hit 110mph and straight all the time, else he would have turned pro). I did sneek in 2 pro-v1s (balls from the pond) but he mishit those quite badly so cannot do a comparison (maybe mental stress).

Why this is an interesting case for me is I can't explain the poor impact factor as the difference is so great for a "good" hit? My scope is calibrated (as of Jun this year) so I am ruling out the scope. That's left me with a few possibilities:
1) His driver head is a lemon (which is unlikely)
2) The range ball sucks (they do look pretty worn)
3) The shaft flex too much on impact
4) combination of the above

Anyway, I have sent him on his way to a club fitter (I am just a lousy golfer so really am in no position to advice him on anything) but the interesting question still lingers in my head... if the club head returns square to the ball, impacts on center or slightly above center with the correct launch angle, will the flex of the shaft affect the smash factor?


Ah, the driver head slipped my mind, another possibility.

I am also interested in this case as well, because the numbers just don't fit. Now I'm really curious what's causing it.

An easy way to compare is obviously putting other club/shaft/flex in his hands to try, and capturing the numbers from there.

This is like a good Hitchcock mystery. Thank you for bringing it to our attention. Do keep us posted of your findings.

Cheers.
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LousyGolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:49 am

No problems... will update this thread once his mystery is solved.
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Derek
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:07 am

interesting ... how would u guys factor the effect of dimples (or lack of) in this case

on a seperate note ... i really wish i had his problem

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Driver: Callway X-Hot 10.5 with Fubuki 50S (pulled from a TM Burner SuperFast)
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LousyGolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:16 am

My guess is that dimples will affect ball flight characteristics (e.g. spin, carry, etc) but should have little effect on the smash factor off the driver face. However, ball hardness is another different story which is more complex that will certainly matter.
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Lee36328
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:45 am

Derek wrote:
interesting ... how would u guys factor the effect of dimples (or lack of) in this case

on a seperate note ... i really wish i had his problem

Dimples? I guess you're referring to the ball and not the player.

Without dimples, the ball won't go very far because dimples are needed to disturb the air to help achieve lift when the ball spins.

If you ever hit a worn-out ball at the range so worn out it's almost completely smooth, you'll see what I mean.

A ping pong ball is dimple-less and the flight reflects that.
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PostSubject: Re: Will flex affect Impact/Smash Factor even if ball goes straight?   Today at 4:27 am

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