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 51 deg, p , sw - difference?

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Slaygay
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PostSubject: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:43 am

Newbie here. Trying to understand whether there's a need to buy all the different wedges? Right now I am using p for all types of chipping shots
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Slicer51
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:59 am

It is good to have at least 2 more wedges. Like the 54 or 56 and 58 or 60 loft.

Higher loft like 58 & 60 good to use for bunker. 54 or 56 give you a higher ball launch and hope to stop the ball from rolling too much.

May I know what loft is your pw ? and how far you hit with it ?

I felt wedges like the rest of the irons that give you a different distant from different loft. Let says you full swing your PW for a 100m. What do you use if you like to hit 90, 80, 70, 60, 50, 40 or 30 m ?
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nrafee
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 1:29 am

If full swing on pw is 100, Half swing should be about 50m.
A gap wedge will give 90, half swing 45
Sw 80, half swing 40.

Hence that's why slicer recommend you get 2 more wedges.

Then again, if you can adjust your swing on your pw to give you the right distance, well you can do without more wedges right Smile
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EastCoastHack
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 7:30 am

I found this information helpful when wondering about the "gap" between my PW (44) and SW (54):

http://www.leaderboard.com/LOFTINFO.htm

http://www.ralphmaltby.com/47

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jeffman88
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:54 am

Slaygay wrote:
Newbie here. Trying to understand whether there's a need to buy all the different wedges? Right now I am using p for all types of chipping shots

hi Slaygay, will try to elaborate what others have said. Smile

As u prob know max nos of golf clubs allowed in golf bag is 14. Some ppl prefer having fewer clubs (hence the golf bag is lighter to carry around mah) and they think they can control and shape various shots by making one club do the work of 2-3 others ( some say manually delofting @ address but then ur every address/ swing speed will need to be altered somewhat depending on the shot u r manipulating. Reason why most players hv a std address is so as to get consistent repeatable swings and hopefully distances and accuracy.

So having one P-wedge for all your chipping shots is great if u can really feel/ control/ shape those shots intuitively but for most of us (also in the spirit of the game) we hv other wedges which are specially designed with different lofts and bounce to help us along... the same holds true for having different woods and hybrids... i mean technically u can bring say 5 clubs to the course and finish a round of golf easily... say Driver, 3 Hybrid, 7iron, P-wedge and Putter... but then that defeats the spirit of the game, also the fun of selecting from ur given arsenal of 14 poisionous clubs, covering all distances for the various course challenges. Hope this helps.
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benedictteo83
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:16 am

i think even if u do not want to get 2 or 3 wedge like most player, at the very least u shuld get a SW. since we are allowed 14clubs in bag, the more the merrier right? try to make this diffcult game easier.
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Birdman
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:40 am

Slaygay wrote:
Newbie here. Trying to understand whether there's a need to buy all the different wedges? Right now I am using p for all types of chipping shots

Hi Slaygay,

From your perspective as a newbie, the bare minimum number of wedges you would need is Pitching, Gap and Sand Wedge. For the moment, stick with the ones that come with your set as they would have the distance gaps spaced out as per your set of irons. Getting additional wedges is a luxury best left to when your wedge game is more consistent and you develop a wider repertoire of partial shots for course play.

It's hard enough for a newbie to execute a full swing as it is, which is why you should use the three wedges (PW, GW, SW). Let the equipment do the work of covering the distances for you while you focus on the full swing. The PW and GW are relatively the same except for loft to cover the distance gaps. All three can be used off the fairway, except that the SW is additionally designed for use out of the sand. If you look at the SW's sole, it is wider than both PW and GW. This helps it glide through the sand on bunker shots rather than dig in, which the PW and GW will do with their narrower soles.

That brings us to the partial shots. In your instance as a newbie, besides a full swing, a partial shot to you would be a chip. Forget about half or three quarter swings for the moment if you even top or duff your chips. Keep it simple, and again let your clubs do the work. The basic chip is executed with the PW for the most part. And the ratio you should work with is 1:4, that is, fly the ball a quarter of the distance and letting it roll out the rest of the way. if you need to fly the ball higher, stick with the same basic chip and substitute with the GW or SW. Of course you would have to swing proportionately harder. How much? That you will have to work out through experience based on your own unique swing.

Once you are reasonably competent at the basic chip (less duffs and tops), then start to expand your repertoire of shots around the green by experimenting on a practice green. This will take you some months, or for some, even years; as the short game takes imagination and feel, developed through years of play and practice.

Then you can start to think about adding the LW (60 and 64 degrees) which are notoriously difficult to hit because they demand more precise contact.

In essence, learn to walk before you run. Keep it simple for the moment, let the equipment do the work for you, and just enjoy your game. Very Happy
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ahnah
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 1:11 pm

If I just have P and S wedge .. will that be enough ?
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Slicer51
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:56 pm

ahnah wrote:
If I just have P and S wedge .. will that be enough ?

Bro, am no pro but just sharing. The question above can only be answer by you.

Having PW & SW, can you hit all those shots that you need ? from the rough, bunker, long & short chip, distance control. If yes, It enough. I saw many players use only 2 wedges. I used 4 wedges as you can see. It is not because I am good but just wanted to make it easy for myself as golf is already difficult enough.

In fact, players using min wedges would consider be a better player, since they knew how. It is like, I play with a local pro that do not carry putter but putt with his wedges but still 2 putt max. It show how good he is when he play with weekend warrior like me Very Happy

Read all the above posts carefully and you will find the answer.
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jeffman88
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:31 pm

Slicer51 wrote:
ahnah wrote:
If I just have P and S wedge .. will that be enough ?

Bro, am no pro but just sharing. The question above can only be answer by you.

Having PW & SW, can you hit all those shots that you need ? from the rough, bunker, long & short chip, distance control. If yes, It enough. I saw many players use only 2 wedges. I used 4 wedges as you can see. It is not because I am good but just wanted to make it easy for myself as golf is already difficult enough.

In fact, players using min wedges would consider be a better player, since they knew how. It is like, I play with a local pro that do not carry putter but putt with his wedges but still 2 putt max. It show how good he is when he play with weekend warrior like me Very Happy

Read all the above posts carefully and you will find the answer.

ahnah: same w me as slicer51 oso carry 4 wedges: P, A, S & L... means i forego one of my longer clubs ...
bro slicer51: wow local pro putts w wedge - thats cool... me w putter oredi got probs Razz.. still looking for ideal putter...
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SigmaOne
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 3:36 pm

Get a Miura Jeff cheers
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http://www.SigmaGolfStudio.com
Slaygay
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:38 pm

That's really very helpful guys. Right now I am still varying the swing on the pitching to get different distance but maybe I think try out the other wedges to see the distance and loft difference.
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Slicer51
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 9:39 pm

jeffman88 wrote:
Slicer51 wrote:
ahnah wrote:
If I just have P and S wedge .. will that be enough ?

Bro, am no pro but just sharing. The question above can only be answer by you.

Having PW & SW, can you hit all those shots that you need ? from the rough, bunker, long & short chip, distance control. If yes, It enough. I saw many players use only 2 wedges. I used 4 wedges as you can see. It is not because I am good but just wanted to make it easy for myself as golf is already difficult enough.

In fact, players using min wedges would consider be a better player, since they knew how. It is like, I play with a local pro that do not carry putter but putt with his wedges but still 2 putt max. It show how good he is when he play with weekend warrior like me Very Happy

Read all the above posts carefully and you will find the answer.

ahnah: same w me as slicer51 oso carry 4 wedges: P, A, S & L... means i forego one of my longer clubs ...
bro slicer51: wow local pro putts w wedge - thats cool... me w putter oredi got probs Razz.. still looking for ideal putter...

I am sure my local pro friend use putter too but he just did not carry it when he is playing with me. He know he can still bet me with one hand Embarassed

Nice irons set you have. I hope you found your idea putter soon. I was even told that, one will know when one found his putter. It is all in the feel and confidence when you are holding the right putter. It is a same feeling when walk into a golf shop and test all the display putter, yet not every model suit you.
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Birdman
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:15 pm

Slaygay,

I don't know how much of newbie you are, but one good reason IMHO to stick with just the basic chip first is to lay down the foundation. Once you know how to consistently hit a basic chip, you have that as a point of reference to which to widen your repertoire of shots. When I say reference point I do not only mean the swing, it also includes your stance, alignment, grip, grip pressure, rhythm, tempo, and ball position.

Because once you start to experiment, trust me, you can very easily lose your foundation if it is not committed to memory. Finesse shots call for infinite variations of all the above I mentioned and no two persons may play the same shot exactly the same. That's why they say the short game is an art, requiring imagination and touch.

As an example, the flop shot. Phil Mickelson plays it with the hinge and hold technique which some find hard to master. Someone else may play it with a simpler one piece swing, turning through with the body. And yet another may play it like a bunker shot, cutting across the line so the ball slides diagonally up the face from heel to toe. All end up with the same result.

The flop shot is a very advanced shot to play, even Phil and Tiger bungle it, what more us mere mortals. Yet it all starts with the humble basic chip, the foundation for all short game shots.

Yes, the basic chip is just one shot that doesn't fit all situations around the green, that's where the increased lofts of the of the GW and SW come into play versus the PW, but if you can't hit the basic chip consistently close to the hole, how to move on to more advanced shots?

Think about it, when you first started golf, you bought the full fourteen clubs. But how many clubs did you use to learn the swing in your basic lessons? Just one, probably the 7 iron, right? Very Happy

What about the lob wedge you may ask? It is a precision tool requiring precise contact. I had a 60 deg lob wedge for many years but hardly used it. Why? Because it is not an easy club to use, tops and duffs are even more commonplace with it than with the other 3 wedges. Anyone who's ever gone through the learning process of using a lob wedge has to conquer the fear of taking a full swing while being just off the green. What more with water behind.

If not proficient with the lob wedge, it can actually hurt your score more than help it. It takes time for the mind to terms with taking a fuller swing from a very short distance. I dare say that anyone who has ever put a lob wedge in play, trying to lob a high one over the bunker onto the green, has seen the ball ending up in the bunker instead umpteen times.

The lob wedge can be an incredible weapon, but it is a double edged sword with a very steep learning curve.

Take comfort that as a newbie, you are allowed a generous handicap to compensate for your lack of skill in this wonderful game, so play knowing you have a buffer to allow for it.

In the meantime, keep things simple while building your foundation. When you are ready for the next level, go for it. Very Happy

As a foot note, you will hear much advice from many players. It is from their perspective, with their own unique swings. They have probably grooved their swings. Some advice may work for you, or it may not. What's important is that you need to take the advice and see it from your perspective and skill level.


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Slicer51
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Mon Sep 10, 2012 10:20 pm

Birdman wrote:
Slaygay,

I don't know how much of newbie you are, but one good reason IMHO to stick with just the basic chip first is to lay down the foundation. Once you know how to consistently hit a basic chip, you have that as a point of reference to which to widen your repertoire of shots. When I say reference point I do not only mean the swing, it also includes your stance, alignment, grip, grip pressure, rhythm, tempo, and ball position.

Because once you start to experiment, trust me, you can very easily lose your foundation if it is not committed to memory. Finesse shots call for infinite variations of all the above I mentioned and no two persons may play the same shot exactly the same. That's why they say the short game is an art, requiring imagination and touch.

As an example, the flop shot. Phil Mickelson plays it with the hinge and hold technique which some find hard to master. Someone else may play it with a simpler one piece swing, turning through with the body. And yet another may play it like a bunker shot, cutting across the line so the ball slides diagonally up the face from heel to toe. All end up with the same result.

The flop shot is a very advanced shot to play, even Phil and Tiger bungle it, what more us mere mortals. Yet it all starts with the humble basic chip, the foundation for all short game shots.

Yes, the basic chip is just one shot that doesn't fit all situations around the green, that's where the increased lofts of the of the GW and SW come into play versus the PW, but if you can't hit the basic chip consistently close to the hole, how to move on to more advanced shots?

Think about it, when you first started golf, you bought the full fourteen clubs. But what how many clubs did you use to learn the swing in your basic lessons? Just one, probably the 7 iron, right? Very Happy

What about the lob wedge you may ask? It is a precision tool requiring precise contact. I had a 60 deg lob wedge for many years but hardly used it. Why? Because it is not an easy club to use, tops and duffs are even more commonplace with it than with the other 3 wedges. Anyone who's ever gone through the learning process of using a lob wedge has to conquer the fear of taking a full swing while being just off the green. What more with water behind.

If not proficient with the lob wedge, it can actually hurt your score more than help it. It takes time for the mind to terms with taking a fuller swing from a very short distance. I dare say that anyone who has ever put a lob wedge in play, trying to lob a high one over the bunker onto the green, has seen the ball ending up in the bunker instead umpteen times.

The lob wedge can be an incredible weapon, but it is a double edged sword with a very steep learning curve.

Take comfort that as a newbie, you are allowed a generous handicap to compensate for your lack of skill in this wonderful game, so play knowing you have a buffer to allow for it.

In the meantime, keep things simple while building your foundation. When you are ready for the next level, go for it. Very Happy

As a foot note, you will hear much advice from many players. It is from their perspective, with their own unique swings. They have probably grooved their swings. Some advice may work for you, or it may not. What's important is that you need to take the advice and see it from your perspective and skill level.



+1
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Slaygay
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PostSubject: Re: 51 deg, p , sw - difference?   Tue Sep 11, 2012 12:02 am

Thanks all for the useful advice!
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