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 Long game more important than short game?

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zhikang
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PostSubject: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 12:28 pm

Some food for thought for everyone here...

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/jason-sobel/molinari-leading-charge-for-statistical-analysis-long-trumps-short-game/
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Derek
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 1:59 pm

The key takeout I got from the article is not so much about which part of the game is more important, but rather that you need to work on your weaknesses and maintain/improve your strengths relative to the averages at your handicap level.

Obviously if you are already a good short game player and can get up and down from inside 30m more than 50% of the time but suffer from wayward drives, you are going to benefit more from improving your driving accuracy.

Conversely, if you consistently hit 8-10 fairways a round but get up and down less than 5% of the time from 30m, you will benefit a lot more from working on your short game.

Like so many things in golf, there is no universal truth, it boils down to the individual and what his/her strengths and weaknesses are.

Using myself as an example, last week, I had probably my best driving game ever ... hit 14/14 fairways and my shortest drive (bit of a mishit) went 200m.  You can't ask for more than that.  In addition, we were playing from the white tee, so it meant that for quite a lot of the Par 4s, I had a short irons or wedges (full and partial) into the green.  I scored 91.  Even from such short distances, I hit TWO GIRs. And my up and down percentage that day was a fantastic ZERO %.  I hit almost every Iron or wedge shot (and some chips as well) FAT ... or when I decided to club up ... would proceed to Pure the shot and sail it over the green.  It was a really depressing experience to repeatedly score bogey from the middle of the fairway with 75m-95m into the green.

In this case, you would be hard pressed to convince me that improving my long game is going to help me score better.

On the other hand, at other points during my golfing journey, my iron play and short game have been sharp, but my driver wayward, with multiple penalty strokes for hazards and OBs.  Shooting 91 under those conditions felt really satisfying.  Likewise, if you told me that my short game will help improve my score, I would have a hard time accepting it.

(The games where Driver, Irons and shortgame were all not working I have decided to erase from my memory ...) 

Aside from the importance of understanding what you need to work on to improve your own game, it is also worthwhile to consider how much time and talent is needed to effect an improvement in the various aspects of golf.

In the article, Molinari uses the example of challenging a Pro to either a) hitting it long and straight or b) chip and putt to emphasise that the long game contributes more to scores than the short game.  I am sure the statistics are correct.  However, the same example can also be used to illustrate that you and I will probably NEVER come close to having the long game of a Pro, but we do have a chance of developing a short game that can have a chance against the Pro (or at the very least, the gap will be less as compared to the long game).

So if you are in a situation whereby all parts of your game are bad, and you want to know what to work on first, I guess it all boils down to which area do you think will require less effort to see a marked improvement.  Driving?  Irons?  Pitching?  Chipping?  Bunker shots?  Putting?

Now, the lengthy post above assumes the objective that you are trying to score better.  If you play the game just for fun, then ignore all this, buy a lot of cheap 2nd hand balls, and just hit it anyway you want as long as it makes you happy.

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zhikang
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 2:02 pm

nice summary Derek. exactly what i felt after reading the article too.
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neutralgolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 3:56 pm

Agree with Derek.

The article is talking about new statistic analysis which will help to identify your area of weekness or greatness. Just hope it will be available to us in due course.

Somehow, I do agree that long game is more important. Imagine having a good drive, the GIR will be higher comparing to a lousy drive. Birdie chances will be higher(or at least you get to try for birdie). Short game will be important only when your drive is not so good, trying to save par, birdie chances not so high.

If you look at those pro or low hcp player, chances are that their long game is relatively good. Hence, their GIR higher, convert more birdies and pars, thus score are lower.

If you look at mid to high hcp, long game not so good, chances are that they are only getting pars and bogeys.

If you want to score well(birdies and pars), long game is important.
If you only aiming pars and bogeys, good short game will come in handy

Just my personal view...
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ChrisD
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:49 pm

How long is considered long and how short is considered short?
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blee67
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 4:57 pm

Derek wrote:
Now, the lengthy post above assumes the objective that you are trying to score better.  If you play the game just for fun, then ignore all this, buy a lot of cheap 2nd hand balls, and just hit it anyway you want as long as it makes you happy.
Derek,  I like this one best... so when are we having a game?  I have tons of 2nd hand balls to offload.... Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:04 pm

ChrisD wrote:
How long is considered long and how short is considered short?
My friend... that question has plagued men all over the world for centuries.

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chien
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:13 pm

ChrisD wrote:
How long is considered long and how short is considered short?
You are considered long. My drives are considered short.

Understood my friend? 

Smile
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neutralgolfer
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:19 pm

ChrisD wrote:
How long is considered long and how short is considered short?
This may be quite subjective to individuals.

For me, any shots that need to utilise my long irons(and above) to put it GIR, would be considered long game. Anything that utilise PW and below would be considered short game.

For driver, 250m and above would be considered long, below 200m would be short.

Just my personal views.
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angyongshen
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:26 pm

Agree with neturalgolfer, imo long game refers to shots made with club length longer than ~37", short game would be shots with club length shorter than ~37". With the exception of the putter, if you are still using belly putters.
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TDO
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:32 pm

Personally, I think long game is important to make the short game easier. Swing 
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slinger
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:38 pm

if have a good short game....

u are never scared that your long game is not long enough....
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 8:54 pm

slinger wrote:
if have a good short game....

u are never scared that your long game is not long enough....
I agree. I believe it's how you arrive that matters.

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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:02 pm

So long game is harder to increase distance or short game harder to improve accuracy.
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zhenxua
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 9:47 pm

to me, long game is fundamental while short game is for scoring

if you send half your drives into hazard/OB/bunker/deep rough every game, no amount of short game magic can help you
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Vinny
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:04 pm

Why is it that nobody talks about SCRAMBLING ~ if nothing else works, this better be working BIG time....
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Duval_S
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:09 pm

Long game is most important. short game can learn....can harness....long game, no talent means no way
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asahi
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:22 pm

Both equally important. But I would give more emphasis to the short game for the purpose of scrambling if I have a decent length off the tee e.g. 200-220m.

If you possess a decent iron shots already......
....A good long game will give you more reassurance in terms of your 2nd shot i.e. iron shots.

If dun have stable iron shots and you dun have a good length off the tee, then you would be in trouble for your next shot as most likely you will be using the woods.
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chien
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Thu Oct 24, 2013 10:57 pm

I won't agree either is more important than which.

I have played with players of different levels and experience.

My personal opinion is, the 2nd shot (and 3rd for par 5) after the tee is more pivotal...

I have seen long hitters bombing in front, but, their games are often destroyed by their 2nd shots.. Either too heavy and balls rolled 50m, or toppish or wayward etc.. 

Reversely, short drivers off the tee, though say 190m only, but with a deadly hybrid which often than not put the ball on the green or close to it.. Worst score for a 380m Par 4 would be a bogey..

Thus, I would advocate, as long the drives are reasonable of length, I would dedicate a lot of attention on the 2nd and 3rd shots...
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 1:13 am

Drive for show, putt for dough.
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TDO
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:35 am

My main problem is can drive but when come to 2nd shot, it nearly always drive me to my grave because my irons are killing me. So I have to find ways to improve my irons, especially from 6i and above. Fortunately and unfortunately, these clubs are no longer in my bag.Sad 
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 8:56 am

To be clear, while I think that arriving is more important than driving, I'm certain that driving onto the short grass is key. I'm not looking for distance but if you can put your ball on the fairway, that gives you a huge advantage.

So, in terms on long game, I'd say dispersion beats distance.

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goh.YF.52
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 9:52 am

After reading through the posts, it makes me think that some catergorise iron and wedge play under short game? Shouldn't it be like anything before a regulations on green be long game, be it a 3 shots to a par5, 2 shots to a par4 and 1 shot to par3.
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:01 am

What is average driving distance for all players? I read somewhere that the average drive is only 180m despite all the improvement in technology.
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goh.YF.52
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PostSubject: Re: Long game more important than short game?   Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:10 am

jmchan wrote:
What is average driving distance for all players? I read somewhere that the average drive is only 180m despite all the improvement in technology.
Probably need to take into account the age group cause the average is average men i suppose
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