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 Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers

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Tituman
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PostSubject: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 4:26 pm

Having seen numerous equipments on sale at the market place, I am rather disappointed with the standard of grading of condition of the equipments by the sellers. Some equipments' condition are not better than 8/10 but were quoted as great condition giving a 9/10 grading. But I guess it could just be inexperience in grading it or individual's perception. Well, in the end it is up to the buyer to decide whether he/she is willing to buy it at that price. Any comments from other lao cheows ?? Question scratch

titu
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mulligan
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:00 pm

at the end of the day,caveat emptor ,'let the buyer beware' , willing seller willing buyer. Very Happy
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ghoonk
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:17 pm

Tell me about it -- i bought a TM bag from one of the members here some time back, only to find that it was a FAKE.
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pushslice
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:24 pm

Using ratings is useless unless GR has a standard definitions of what those ratings mean. An example would be the one used by CallawayPreOwned website.

Else sellers should look at the pics from Chocoman, see "100% Confirmed Backspin Super Sale" for an example of a good sale posting. Really clean, high res, well-taken pictures.

Let the pics do the talking or the rating. An extra service would be to allow potential/serious buyers to test on the range. I did all my sales this way.

Other than that it's really buyer beware.
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ghoonk
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:26 pm

The reason I like shopping on golfWRX and eBay is that I can see seller ratings. Buyers and sellers can leave feedback about each other, which helps build up or tear apart the integrity of a buyer/seller
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Tituman
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:38 pm

ghoonk wrote:
Tell me about it -- i bought a TM bag from one of the members here some time back, only to find that it was a FAKE.

Hi ghoonk, why does that don't surprise me at all ? I feel for you. I hope you did not pay genuine item price.

titu
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Tituman
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:46 pm

I have seen people advertised their item as brand new and later add on just hit a few balls at the range. For me, if I was the seller, my wording will be as good as new or mint . Then mentioned hit a couple of balls at the range. It can never be brand new once a ball has been hit ! As for grading, it could only go as high as 9.5 to 9.8. A brand new means plastic cover is still unwrapped ! Well, .....sigh...... silent

titu
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nientsu
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:21 pm

I think we should hav a 'post of shame'.

This way, we can deter from people to wrongly grade their items for sale.
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ghoonk
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:33 pm

Tituman wrote:
ghoonk wrote:
Tell me about it -- i bought a TM bag from one of the members here some time back, only to find that it was a FAKE.

Hi ghoonk, why does that don't surprise me at all ? I feel for you. I hope you did not pay genuine item price.

titu

No, only SGD50, but if I knew that item was fake, I wouldn't even have bothered.

To be fair, there are some people i would buy stuff from on this forum, mostly because I have met them and seen how they treat their kit. Also, buyers and sellers should always meet up to view the item before a commitment is made from either end, in order to ensure that expectations are aligned.
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ghoonk
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:42 pm

ghoonk wrote:
Tituman wrote:
ghoonk wrote:
Tell me about it -- i bought a TM bag from one of the members here some time back, only to find that it was a FAKE.

Hi ghoonk, why does that don't surprise me at all ? I feel for you. I hope you did not pay genuine item price.

titu

No, only SGD50, but if I knew that item was fake, I wouldn't even have bothered.

To be fair, there are some people i would buy stuff from on this forum, mostly because I have met them and seen how they treat their kit. Also, buyers and sellers should always meet up to view the item before a commitment is made from either end, in order to ensure that expectations are aligned.

Even GolfWRX has its share of bad hats. I just bought an Adams Speedline 8.5* tour issued driver with Matriz Ozik X-CON 5 in X flex for USD245. Seller MIA after payment, email account was disabled, and the driver finally reached me after 2 weeks. I open the box, shaft and grip in good shape, and had a frigging dent in the crown (appears that someone teed up the ball too high, ripped one, ball not only scratched the crown but also dented it slightly) - ad said no idiot marks, 8.5/10 condition. USD245 down the lonkang, but I'm going to game it this weekend to see if it's as good as everyone says it is -- not sure if the dent is going to affect performance

That's the 2nd time I got a crap seller on GolfWRX (first time was a Canadian guy who sold me my Cleveland CG1 Black Pearl irons, and it was supposed to come with 4 Cleveland wedges (588s and RTGs) and a TM V-Steel 3w, and only shipped the irons. The irons arrived with so many dings on the sole that they looked like they were left the in middle of PIE for a week, and that idiot neglected to mention that someone went at the grooves with a regroover and did a shit job of it, leaving gashes in the smooth space towards the toe. Grips were also in terrible condition. USD300 down the lonkang.

Lesson here: always exercise a lot of caution when buying from seller with less than 10 feedback on GolfWRX.
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Duval_S
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:44 pm

Hey Bro Ghoonk....totally with you on that....if its a spade call it a spade.

In my view, there is nothing like knowing who the seller is as in person...but the very least is to see the number of postings.

so far, I only bot fm MC.....what a buy...only in 2nd game, catch bird liao.....

OK, going back to the thread header.....the ratings is very subjective, guess its human nature to say its always good......except when come to HC (I suppose)
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asahi
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:50 pm

Hihi....I think best not to put rating. Just pics will do..after all, pictures tell a thousand words.
Leave it to buyer to judge for himself. All of us got different judgement on condition.
At the end, up to buyer and seller to negotiate. Razz
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TLHENG
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:22 pm

Pictures posted may not be that of the real stuff for sale. So it is useless to just look at the pics posted. See and feel the item itself before making the purchase.
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vcrpex
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:34 pm

ghnook,
read your post on the driver just now in wrx. even the pictures at the beginning looks pretty good. i just bought 2 used heads from golfwrx myself. so far it already reach the borderlinx address that i used. will see how the conditions are when they reach sg.

when a club or a set of club is used, it is used, no matter how many times, be it 20 balls or 1 seasons. but still always have some sellers who put mint condition or brand new when they already have hit it before, be it range or green. Just wondering, what difference does it make hitting a driver on range and green? it is still off a tee. they put mint or brand new so that they can called for a higher price rather than the used price. but as always, caveat emptor. when the price in the marketplace is just slightly lower than what you can get from retail, do really consider the retail shops or the golf shops where you can really look and see the club before buying. Sometimes you might be able to really get a good deal if you look hard enough.

just my point of view, they can grade them what they want, but put it out at a reasonable used price rather than trying to push for brand new prices when it is not. there are many used sets that can be found in Singapore without even going to foreign websites. Even foreign websites when you get good deals, it still can cheaper(with the shipping back to Sg) than some of the prices for the used ones locally at times.
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ghoonk
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:18 pm

correct. To be fair, the sellers with higher ratings tend to be more conservative with their ratings, e.g. they'd rate a putter 9.5/10 simply because there are some brush marks on the sole, or if the head plastic has been removed.

Most of the time, the stuff I get come in acceptable condition, save the bad incidents, or in a better light, the new heads I bought that were literally new, with the tour van shrink wrap and stickers still on them, and the weight is spot-on.

Be careful of eBay though -- I have seen Adams 'tour-issue' clubs being sold without the paint break, and a reliable source confirms that the paint break is present in all tour issues from Adams. At least the one I got today had the paint break.
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Tituman
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:37 pm

I bot quite frequently from another popular US Forum called 4GEA. So far all my deals with them except one were accurately rated. Some arrived in better condition than they rated it. The one that got away, literally got away with my money and never see him again in the forum. Anyway, dealing thru internet, there is always a chance that one day you will be scammed. Like old chinese saying, if you climb up the mountain every day, sure one day you will meet the tiger.

titu

www.4gea.com
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Yarra
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:46 pm

Can't trust everybody, I guess. Things like this always happen in forums. Although I never got any problems with conditions being worse than described, but I do have occasional hiccups sometimes.

A while back, I traded goods with a guy in Arizona. Conditions are great, better than described. It turns out that my DET is actually a scam. It was brand new although admittedly I got it from a friend who bought it from ebay. I offered him to return the DET to me and I will pay for the shipping. It's an honest mistake, swear to God!

He refused and decided to go ahead with the trade simply because he didn't want to back out of a deal he made. Hmm... nice guy, I thought. As it turned out, the driver head that he sent me weighed at 213 grams!

So, although not ALL of them are scam artists but you do come across 'honest mistakes' like I did once in a while. But there are real scam artists out there, especially on ebay! I usually steer clear of something that is too good to be true in terms of pricing. Usually they are too good to be true...
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peace2903
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:33 pm

Tituman wrote:
I bot quite frequently from another popular US Forum called 4GEA. So far all my deals with them except one were accurately rated. Some arrived in better condition than they rated it. The one that got away, literally got away with my money and never see him again in the forum. Anyway, dealing thru internet, there is always a chance that one day you will be scammed. Like old chinese saying, if you climb up the mountain every day, sure one day you will meet the tiger.

titu

www.4gea.com

Titu, you are spot on. If you decide to buy from internet, there are risks. If not, buy from shop direct! And of course ratings are subjective, unless you can come up with a rating scale and description. Even some website with rating scale (cwsgolf.com) can be inaccurate!
But the best thing buying from the forum is that at least u roughly knows who's the seller.
So I guess the best is to leave out the rating since the pictures and meet-up can determine the condition.
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vcrpex
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PostSubject: Re: Disappointing grading of equipment conditions by sellers   Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:46 pm

titu,
i agreed with your saying of dealing through internet, there is always a chance of a scam. but actually in real life, it is very possible too. to some they called it business opportunity, to some they called them scams or unethical. it is up to the individual to weigh the risk. Very simply, why do those retail shops can sell the club half the price after one season or sometimes it is only half a year? Do anyone think the value of the club really drop after one season? Or rather do people really think at half the price, the retail shops are just trying to clear stock and not making money? i am sure they are still making profit despite the half price drop. The cost of the products are definitely much lower, but as with any business the mark up is always there especially for luxury goods.

imho, the difference between business and scams is just a fine line, with scams going beyond reasonable means to cheat. that is why there is things like retail prices, and during sale, they could give such huge discounts. Despite the huge discount, the company will still be making money. Else how do they continue their business cost and profit year after year? Scams will be those all out to cheat by saying brand new and pricing it as brand new price when it is not brand new. the moment it is being hit, it is used be it once or 100, range, simulation or green. i guess that's all for my rant.
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