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 Shafts and how it affects us

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rocky
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PostSubject: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 10:12 pm

To all the pros and club fitters, this is a question for you. I'm going to sound like a little kid but here goes...

I ran into this uncle at the range this evening and he let me test drive his new shaft. It was an UST graphite shaft, silverish grey in colour. He was mumbling about the club becoming too long! He let me have a go at it. It felt a little heavy but it instantly gave me 2 clubs distance! He only refitted his PW, which is a 48.5 degree Bridgestone Forged irons (I think J33). He said he is hitting it 140m, which he did! I was hitting that same wedge 110m! I only hit my own PW 95m, which is a 45 degree, btw! Wow!

Any idea why this is happening? Does changing shafts give you obscene distances? My pro always tells me that the shaft technology nowadays are excellent. Club fitters tell me that after-market shafts make for a more stable club. So, who's right? Or, is everyone right? Means it's time to plough some cash into shafts?

I seriously do not mind a PW at 110m! WOW!!!!!

Regards
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Technospaz
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 10:38 pm

I was a non-believer at first. Then one day, I spoke with Eric about reviewing my swing. He examined my swing, analyzed my swingspeed and reviewed my current driver. He suggested a change in my driver shaft and I wasn't certain. After some thinking, I decided to go for it. The shaft was customized for my swingspeed and style, and it has made a huge difference. My driver shots are more consistent (yes, I still tend to have wild shots but these are reduced) and distance-wise, I get a longer ball. The shaft feels good - it's firmer and heavier, and gives me more confidence when I swing the driver Smile

So, in short, there is a difference in the shafts you use. While some may be very happy with the regular shafts, others (like myself) see the benefit in a more customized shaft.

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The Golfing Machine
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 10:45 pm

Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.
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kopiO
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 10:50 pm

i recall the saying... the shaft is just like the transmission of a car... engine/power still comes from elsewhere, and of course, everyone needs a good transmission.
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solarpop
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 11:05 pm

Regardless of what shaft, 140m on a PW is quite scary. Does it have the typical ball flight of a PW? If it did, i can imagine the ball must have been damn bloody freaking high.
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rocky
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 11:10 pm

Thank you all for the reply. Appreciate it.

I re-read my own post again and I realised I did not post explicit questions. What I really wanted to ask were these:

From a Coaching Pro standpoint:
1. How do you determine your student requires a change of equipment, (in my case here, shaft changes)?
2. As what TGM mentioned, if a student is serious about the game, how would you advise the student on changing shafts?

My assumption is that Coaching Pros come from a "been there, done that" perspective and therefore will be able to tell from marketing gimmicks or factual truth. (An analogy would be to compare Coaches as Master Chefs who know which knives are most suitable for cutting various kinds of meats, vegetables or fish, if you know what I mean. For Coaching Pros it would be which kind of clubs/shafts are best for which kind of students.)


From a Club Fitter standpoint:
I understand that Club Fitters have the technology to measure swing speed, gather data on impact location and some have video cameras to watch the player swing in ultra-slow motion. Many people think all they need to do is to match the data collected with the type of shaft and viola! You have a custom fitted equipment! I think that sounds all too simple to be true!

So to Professional Club Fitters,
How do you recommend shaft changes for your customers, bearing in mind that all customers have some form of budget constraint?

Thanks.
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rocky
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Tue Jul 28, 2009 11:11 pm

solarpop wrote:
Regardless of what shaft, 140m on a PW is quite scary. Does it have the typical ball flight of a PW? If it did, i can imagine the ball must have been damn bloody freaking high.

You bet! It just stayed in the air... I thought it's never going to come down! I'm still in WOW state!
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benhogan
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:04 am

I will be lying if I say distance doesnt matter.
I once hit a soft 3 wood and Mr QQ hit his 6 iron. I was on he wasn't.
Of cos he is an awesome golfer, I can never dream of playing like him.
Play within yourself, do not be too preoccupied with hitting it far.
Hit it straight.

These kids always laugh at me and say, "uncle you use what?" I said " 4 iron, he replied "I use 6", "BUT I am closer to the hole young man." Rolling Eyes
I have played with 2 former Laguna Club champs and the same happened, 2 to 3 clubs longer than me, 1 water, 1 too long, I put on n birdied, both bogeyed. ( I was playing off 7, many years ago )
My driver's avg 180m, no bluff. I play in the low 90s now.
Just me. cyclops
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weesern
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:27 am

distance does matter... but should not be obsessed with it. a proper impact with definately give you the distance.

swinging at 100mph and top the ball vs swinging at 90 and impact on sweet spot... which will give you better result??
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grooveballer
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:00 am

after Eric of BF checked my swing and fitted me with the appropriate shafts, the dispersions become tighter, and i became more confident of my swing. getting fitted is key to an enjoyable and improving game.
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Technospaz
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:06 am

grooveballer wrote:
after Eric of BF checked my swing and fitted me with the appropriate shafts, the dispersions become tighter, and i became more confident of my swing. getting fitted is key to an enjoyable and improving game.

Hear Hear!!

I will say, however, that having a custom fitted shaft isn't going to work miracles if your swing is still shaky. Hitting a good shot is a combination of many things. The ones which you can fix quite easily are like fitting but the more tricky ones like fixing flaws in your swing require more work. The rewards, however, are priceless Smile
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G_Man
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:58 am

The Golfing Machine wrote:
Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.

Yes, the very serious players much get the stiffest shafts they can. ideally just below a kilo in weight. gold or platinium plated for better feel!
Please la...

contrary to popular belief and I hope Eric agrees with me here:
A shaft is not custom made for you. Ironically you fall into a statistically probable range of people.
So unlike what mummy has told me, I am not all that special, I can use a shaft off the shelf as long as it is suitable for me.

Here in lies the problem, what is suitable for you???
I dont think there is a industry standard as yet that pigeon holes what regular, stiff or ladies flex is meant to be. thus different manufacturers would be building clubs on what they define internally as a L/R/S flex.

Now what Eric does is different. He stocks an array of shafts that can be tweaked to fit a specific swing speed and other variables. ie: Stiff + 5% lagi more stiff...

Thus after watching you on the launch monitor and more importantly watching the launch monitors number, he can decipher what is a likely "Best Fit" shaft. He doesnt acutally call the factory to order a "G_Man shaft", but he has the array needed to find the nearest/closest matching and altering it slightly to better suit the player.

After Eric fitted my shaft....




I paid him....

The rest still comes down to technique and practice. But knowing the shaft is fitted for me definately helps. and besides, it isnt just the stiftness that is important. Torgue is something to ponder too..

I am trully a advocate for proper fitting... Even beginner that are looking to get serious should talk to a fitter. Maybe not to be fitted, but for knowledge...
Its hard to tell whats the actual differences in clubs are till you talk the techie stuff. But on a superficial level, it is still something that is worth knowing... eg: Why are game improvement Irons game improving??? Are there drawbacks?

Anyway, we all seem to work the assumption that the DEN caters to the single handicappers only. My feel is the den caters to whoever cares to come down and ask.. To all those people looking to buy clubs, advise, talk to a fitter first. You will be surprised what you will learn by asking. If you dont want to do it face to face, ask here. There are a lot of Freaks here that have a whole world of knowledge on golf equipment. Just dont comment abt Scottys and you are fine.


Last edited by G_Man on Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:09 am; edited 1 time in total
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Lamts18
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:06 am

The Golfing Machine wrote:
Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.


Sir, IMHO, i beg to differ.... i'm serious about my game but i have to step down... Smile
Not all humans are build the same, some swing slow, some swing fast. we have to find the shaft that suits our own swing.... but then, you're a machine so you are not the same.. Cheers...
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Dstruc
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:23 am

Technospaz wrote:
grooveballer wrote:
after Eric of BF checked my swing and fitted me with the appropriate shafts, the dispersions become tighter, and i became more confident of my swing. getting fitted is key to an enjoyable and improving game.

Hear Hear!!

I will say, however, that having a custom fitted shaft isn't going to work miracles if your swing is still shaky. Hitting a good shot is a combination of many things. The ones which you can fix quite easily are like fitting but the more tricky ones like fixing flaws in your swing require more work. The rewards, however, are priceless Smile

True Dat!
customise shaft w/ Bad swing = Oh Shit!
Stock shaft w/ good swing = Nice shot!
Customise shaft w/ Good Swing = Wow! F*#Kin' Nice short!
Stock shaft w/ Bad Swing = Wah lan a... F'up club....
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S70B
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:14 pm

Lamts18 wrote:
The Golfing Machine wrote:
Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.


Sir, IMHO, i beg to differ.... i'm serious about my game but i have to step down... Smile
Not all humans are build the same, some swing slow, some swing fast. we have to find the shaft that suits our own swing.... but then, you're a machine so you are not the same.. Cheers...


lol! ROFL
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watermyforrest
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:39 pm

Dstruc wrote:
customise shaft w/ Bad swing = Oh Shit!
Stock shaft w/ good swing = Nice shot!
Customise shaft w/ Good Swing = Wow! F*#Kin' Nice short!
Stock shaft w/ Bad Swing = Wah lan a... F'up club....

This is good... remind me of some chemistry formula
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Khorkar
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:41 pm

Good and funny post Dstruc....
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DGman
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:17 pm

i can't remember where i read this but Geoff Ogilvy once said that he is the worst tester of golf clubs. after 5 shots he could hit any clubs to about the same distance and accuracy.

What it means is he has a tremendous amount of talent. his motor memory adjust to different swing weights and flex instead of rejecting something new and his tempo can be instantly tweaked to accommodate to the clubs in his hand. Ernie Els is also known to have the ability to change to an entire set of irons between the 2nd and 3rd day of play. he switch on and off just like that.

LCB driver club head speed is close to 120 mph, he uses a high 60g S (bordering XS) flex and he bombs his driver straight and long. CR, another Asian Tour Pro has a club head speed of 110 mph and uses high 70g XXS flex. MM has a club head speed of over 110 mph and uses a mid 70 XS shaft. LCB hits it the longest with the same amount of accuracy.

So what does it tell us. Different strokes for different folks. Find the flex that works for you and if you are one of those who are not easily adaptable to changes, stick to the beaten track.

can anyone guess what shaft and flex QQ uses on his irons? care to guess?

the above are not your average joe, they all play on the Asian Tour and i have the honour of having analyse and recorded their swing speed.

DGman


Last edited by DGman on Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:23 pm; edited 2 times in total
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S70B
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:19 pm

The Golfing Machine wrote:
Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.

CCC, someone calling you... Laughing

I think you are not addressing the whole golfing public here. Many ppl on this forum are not built 15-stone and swing at 110-115mph to handle shafts like yours.

Are you asking ppl to 'step up' and switch to heavier shafts or get fitted in the 1st place? Very misleading wor Machine Man cos 'regular' can mean the flex or the 'stock' shafts le. Wink
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weesern
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:24 pm

i think he means fittng instead of getting a heavier shaft. and regular means stock shaft. thats wat i think...
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S70B
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 10:27 pm

Lets hope so. Dun wanna put a dent on that street cred. Wink

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The Golfing Machine
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Wed Jul 29, 2009 11:30 pm

S70B wrote:
The Golfing Machine wrote:
Regular shafts are for regular joes.
If you are really serious about your game, you need to step up.

I personally favor heavy and stiff (V2 85g X) shafts as I want something solid to drive against.

CCC, someone calling you... Laughing

I think you are not addressing the whole golfing public here. Many ppl on this forum are not built 15-stone and swing at 110-115mph to handle shafts like yours.

Are you asking ppl to 'step up' and switch to heavier shafts or get fitted in the 1st place? Very misleading wor Machine Man cos 'regular' can mean the flex or the 'stock' shafts le. Wink

Paiseh haha...
Step up meaning to the next level - that is get fitted for clubs.
Even Michael Schumacher can't win in a Datsun!
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weesern
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Thu Jul 30, 2009 1:13 am

Y are u stuck in the old days??? no more Datsun, they are Nissan now, maybe Schumacher can win in a GTR... Topic OFF
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The Golfing Machine
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PostSubject: Re: Shafts and how it affects us   Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:21 am

I know no more Datsun liao...
I was just trying to prove a point, which is
you may never reach your full potential despite your talent if
you play clubs that don't fit.
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